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Obama Adminstration Uses Coercion to Encourage Outsourcing - hmmm

Posted: Sep 01, 2011

Gibson Guitars, accused of using illegally imported wood, a claim that Gibson refutes and for which the company has filed documentation to the contrary, has now been told that their problems "would go away" if they used labor in Madagascar.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/blog/watercooler/2011/sep/1/picket-gibson-guitar-ceo-obama-admin-told-us-our-p/

For those of you brave enough to access this site...you can hear an account of the entire debacle from the lips of Gibson CEO directly.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/update-gibson-guitar-ceo-says-feds-told-him-to-outsource-labor-to-madagascar/

Out of context - sm

[ In Reply To ..]
The company is being investigated for illegally importing exotic wood. There are considerations about import laws, wood as a resource -vs- guitars as a product, not an encouragement to offshore. Gibson will get their day in court.

Bush administration law enforced - sm

[ In Reply To ..]
On May 22, 2008, the U.S. Congress passed a landmark amendment to the 100 year-old Lacey Act, originally enacted to prohibit the transportation of illegally captured animals or wildlife products across state lines. The new law extended this protection to plants - including timber, paper, and other forest products - thereby giving the U.S. government a powerful tool to eliminate illegally sourced wood and increase transparency in the global forest product supply chain.

You're omitting an important fact. - hmmm

[ In Reply To ..]
Gibson's wood is documented to be in keeping with the Lacey Act.

You missed the point... - hmmm

[ In Reply To ..]
My point had NOTHING to do with the wood. It had to do with the Department of Justice encouraging Gibson to manufacture outside of the United States.

Did you even listen to the interview?

Or maybe you don't care - you might be one of the 39% that still approves of Obama.

I got your point that you were trying to blame Obama - for enforcing a Bush era law.

[ In Reply To ..]
As confirmed by your last sentence.

What? You're blaming Obama for the - offshoring disaster? NM

[ In Reply To ..]
x

Outsourcing for Gibson - AnnieOakley

[ In Reply To ..]
I heard about this yesterday on the talk radio station. What you said is true about the outsourcing from Gibson. Imagine that.

Thank you! At least there is some sanity here. - hmmm

[ In Reply To ..]
And a few folks who chose never to drink the Kool-Aid.

And where in the Lacey Act... - hmmm

[ In Reply To ..]
does it give the Department of Justice or any other part of the administration the power to coerce a company to relocate their operations offshore? I didn't see it.

That is a figment of your imagination, - not what the feds are doing.

[ In Reply To ..]
As usual, you are trying to make this as simplistic as possible since that is the only way false assertions can even begin to stand the light of scrutiny. As the NPR article reports (the other side of the story), the Lacey Act is not the only law at play here. The labor issue relates to specifications found in various trade agreements that require exported raw and processed timber products to be cut, logged, reported, in some cases processed, and transported by LOCAL labor. Specifically, in this case, these various stages of exporting Madagascar woods (assuming they are NOT endangered species that violate the Lacey Act...evidently not the case with Gibson's current ebony and rosewood litigation) should have been carried out by Malagesy labor. Gibson is being investigated for multiple violations of the Lacey Act AND regional trade agreements. Within this context, it would make perfect sense that the feds may have advised him that, "had he used Malagesy labor, this would have gone away". Got it? Your conclusion that the Obama administration is trying to "coerce" outsourcing of labor to Madagascar is, of course, false, false, false. What they are trying to "coerce" is compliance with longstanding trade agreements. Last time I checked, that is a perfectly legitimate pursuit of the US Department of Justice. It's in their job description. Capice?

IF (and that is a very big IF) the feds ever said anything remotely similar to what the CEO claims, it would have been said within the context of those trade law violations. That is the problem with Fox/Beck and buddies' reporting out of context. It may fool their vulnerable and highly receptive audiences into believing half-truths, but those of us residing outside that camp....not so much.

And you omitted the other side to the story, so - here it is.

[ In Reply To ..]
Of note is the passage where the Justice Department asserts that Gibson KNOWINGLY used banned ebony and rosewood produced via illegal timber harvests. Paperwork Gibson's CEO produced evidently failed to trace the supply chain of the wood all the way back to the tree, which is required by law. Oh, and BTW, the statement allegedly made by one of those infamous Fox/Beck unnamed federal agents has just about subzero credibility within your "coersion" context. In fact, the labor issue seems to be entirely superfluous to the import/export of endangered species woods.

Why Gibson Guitar was Raided by the Justice Department

Last week federal marshals raided the Gibson Guitar Corporation in Tennessee. It wasn't the first time. The government appears to be preparing to charge the famous builder of instruments with trafficking in illegally obtained wood. It's a rare collision of music and environmental regulation.

In the hottest part of an August Tennessee day last Thursday, Gibson Guitar CEO Henry Juszkiewicz stood out in the full sun for 30 minutes and vented to the press about the events of the day before.

"We had a raid," he said, "with federal marshals that were armed, that came in, evacuated our factory, shut down production, sent our employees home and confiscated wood."

The raids at two Nashville facilities and one in Memphis recalled a similar raid in Nashville in November 2009, when agents seized a shipment of ebony from Madagascar. They were enforcing the Lacey Act, a century-old endangered species law that was amended in 2008 to include plants as well as animals. But Juszkiewicz says the government won't tell him exactly how "or if" his company has violated that law.

"We're in this really incredible situation. We have been implicated in wrongdoing and we haven't been charged with anything," he says. "Our business has been injured to millions of dollars. And we don't even have a court we can go to and say, 'Look, here's our position.'"

The U.S. Justice Department won't comment about the case it's preparing, but a court motion filed in June asserts Gibson's Madagascar ebony was contraband. It quotes emails that seem to show Gibson taking steps to maintain a supply chain that's been connected to illegal timber harvests.

Andrea Johnson, director of forest programs for the Environmental Investigation Agency in Washington, says the Lacey Act requires end users of endangered wood to certify the legality of their supply chain all the way to the trees. EIA's independent investigations have concluded that Gibson knowingly imported tainted wood.

"Gibson clearly understood the risks involved," says Johnson. "Was on the ground in Madagascar getting a tour to understand whether they could possibly source illegally from that country. And made a decision in the end that they were going to source despite knowing that there was a ban on exports of ebony and rosewood."

Gibson vigorously denies these allegations, maintaining that all of its purchases from Madagascar have complied with U.S. and Malagasy law. A company attorney says Gibson has presented documents to support that claim and that the recent raid seized legally obtained wood from India. He adds that the company stopped importing wood from Madagascar in 2009.

Chris Martin, Chairman and CEO of the C.F. Martin Guitar Co. in Nazareth, Pa., says that when he first heard guitars built from Madagascar rosewood, he dreamed it might be the long-sought substitute for Brazilian rosewood, whose trade was banned in the 1990s due to over-harvest. Then the situation in Madagascar changed.

"There was a coup," Martin says. "What we heard was the international community has come to the conclusion that the coup created an illegitimate government. That's when we said, 'Okay, we can not buy any more of this wood.'"

And while some say the Lacey Act is burdensome, Martin supports it: "I think it's a wonderful thing. I think illegal logging is appalling. It should stop. And if this is what it takes unfortunately to stop unscrupulous operators, I'm all for it. It's tedious, but we're getting through it."

Others in the guitar world aren't so upbeat. Attorney Ronald Bienstock says the Gibson raids have aroused the guitar builders he represents because the Lacey Act is retroactive. He says they're worried they might be forced to prove the provenance of wood they acquired decades ago.

"There hasn't been that moment where people have quote tested the case. 'What is compliance? What is actual compliance? How have I complied?' We're lacking that."

He's even warned clients to be wary of traveling abroad with old guitars, because the law says owners can be asked to account for every wooden part of their guitars when re-entering the U.S. The law also covers the trade in vintage instruments.

Nashville's George Gruhn is one of the world's top dealers of old guitars, banjos and other rare stringed instruments. "It's a nightmare," he says. "I can't help it if they used Brazilian rosewood on almost every guitar made prior to 1970. I'm not contributing to cutting down Brazilian rosewood today."

Gruhn acknowledges that the government has tried to create exemptions to cover vintage instruments. But he says they are rife with delays and to play it safe he's nearly eliminated the 40% of his business that used to deal with overseas buyers. "This is a new normal," says the EIA's Andrea Johnson. "And it takes getting used to."

Johnson defends the Lacey Act and the government's efforts to enforce it. "Nobody here wants this law to founder on unintended consequences," she says. "Because ultimately everybody understands that the intent here is to reduce illegal logging and send a signal to the markets that you've got to be asking questions and sourcing wood in a responsible way."

What constitutes that responsible way may only become clear when the government finally charges Gibson and the company gets the day in court it says it wants so badly.

http://www.npr.org/blogs/therecord/2011/08/31/140090116/why-gibson-guitar-was-raided-by-the-justice-department

Two sides to every story - As is responsible

[ In Reply To ..]
the Justice Department has not commented. It amazes me the quick "rush to judgement" based on the words of the law breaker. Most criminals lie.

I am all against the importation of "exotic woods". The Great Lakes are getting contaminated by exotic species killing the native fish, our forests are being defoliated by non-native invasive insects. I went to an import furniture shop one day and was sickened. I had noticed the insecticide smell when I first walked in, and I am very glad I did not buy anything.

This is not the first time they were investigated for this--the first time was shortly after Bush signed this into law. I am also surprised that anyone who would take a discussion of law and twist it to say it was coercion. You might be better off spending your time asking questions about the corporations who offshore their income rather than pay taxes in the US.

Imported Chinese dog food killed my dog - Buy "Made in America"

[ In Reply To ..]
We have to protect ourselves from the lead in our kids toys, etc. If this exotic wood has bad stuff, we should find a domestic product. Tell that to Gibson.

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