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Banging my head against the wall - over points off for commas

Posted: Feb 27, 2012

I keep getting dinged for comma usage, and I'm not one to overuse them, though I fully support the use of an Oxford comma. I am old school, and I've been taught the following about commas

1) They go before a conjunction when what could be complete sentence follows.

2) They do not go before or after (unless there is a strange circumstance, i.e, "indeed" or some such wording thrown in) a conjunction w/o a complete sentence following it.

My hospitals are "modified verbatim," meaning correct grammar and make complete sentences when possible. I keep getting my commas deleted and others added, thereby taking anywhere from 0.25 to 1 point off my score simply because we disagree on comma placement. Do you guys think I'm just stirring or am I right to defend myself? I was an English major, BTW, before I went into sports medicine.

commas - mauigirl

[ In Reply To ..]
had the same thing happen to me...been doing this job for 15 years! I think they would concentrate more on accuracy and not so much commas...

same thing here, never mind I spend time researching some new cancer protocol, etc. nm - samehere

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xx

Commas - Lucy

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I too was an English major. I had to memorize the rules for commas and semicolons in school and was taught by an English PhD who was fabulous. I had the same thing happen to me by QA. Did it every occur to you that QA can be wrong? Every time they did that to me, I recited the rule for the comma I used. I tend not to overuse commans but then again it can be a matter of opinion when you are using a comman to prevent misreading in a sentence. I even went and reviewed all of the rules of comman usage in case there were some cobwebs in my brain only to find out I was right and QA was wrong. Not to get on the wrong side of QA which can be bad also, because sometimes they think they are the "queens" of the English language, but after that they left me alone. If you defend yourself just be absolutely sure you are correct. Maybe then they will learn something from you and leave you alone.

Commas - Lucy

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Sorry, meant commma and not comman. Not awake yet - work nights.

Does your employer follow the BOS at all? - Happy MT Robin

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I know most of the time it's more of a pain than not, but what you have cited here is EXACTLY what the BOS says (section 6.2.3 Independent Clauses).

Is this something worth bringing to the attention of your QA supervisor?

If it was a one-off thing, I'd ignore it, but if this is pretty consistent and you know you are correct and have the literature to back you up, then I'd definitely address it. Depending on where you work, that point score may mean the difference between a passing QA score or not.

Thanks from OP - Grammar girl

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I'm trying to defend myself, and I've only been marked off for one real issue in 6 months, yet commas and insertion of "a, and, the," etc., is another problem. We are supposed to make complete sentences when possible. I really can't see how to do that w/o adding a word like that here and there. THANKS, again, to my fellow grammar-lovers.

QA - mt3

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I'm far from a Grammar Queen. However, when it comes to QA remember they really are human too. If you cite a reference (book, page, etc) and include your team lead/manager on the email, ASKING FOR CLARIFICATION (not declaring QA to be incorrect), you might find it easier to work this issue out.

I have rare interaction with QA. When I do, however, if there is something I disagree with, I will either provide them with a reference or ask that they provide me with one.

Of course, this depends on who you work for. The Giantitis companies really don't have a clue what the left hand is doing while the right is marking things incorrect.

See message - nn

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I say if the comma does not change the meaning of the sentence or affect patient's care then it shouldn't be counted off for.

A heads up maybe or an FYI, but no need to deduct points. As the other posters said, QA can be wrong sometimes too.

The way I see it.. - if QA is taking off for

[ In Reply To ..]
you, they are likely doing it to every MT, so you are not being singled out for special harassment.

A long time ago I did QA and got a little bit over-zelous on the commas with only the best intentions, thinking I was helping the MTs make a better product. I learned fast that this was an uphill battle, with commas being the least of the worries of a lot of them.

Bottom line: I wouldn't even worry about it unless they are threatening to fire you or dock your pay, and if that's the case they'll probably find something anyway no matter how hard you try.

QA and commas - MT Mom

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Is the trend leaning towards companies (IC and employers) firing MTs for what "they" deem as improper comma use? It seems like more and more companies are not only looking for correct terminology, etc., but they are counting off on inappropriate comma usage, or lack thereof, as major mistakes, thus lowering the QA score for the report below 98% in some instances. Not all MTs have been trained the same way or are on the same page as far as what is the correct way for punctuation. Maybe there should be a standard set that all companies must abide by to make life easier for not only the MTs, but for everyone involved in processing the reports...just a thought.

QA - Addison

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QA really gets to me sometimes when they worry about such petty nonsense. Last week, I typed there WERE no signs of infection, and QA changed it to there ARE no signs of infection. REALLY!!?? Maybe QA misheard and I didn't. Sheesh!!

Addison, - Had the same thing happen

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The patient had expired, so I was typing all verbs in past tense (dude's dead so I'm pretty sure he doesn't still have colitis). "Was" was changed to "is" repeatedly.

Same Thing - Addison

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In either case, I'm pretty sure it doesn't really make a difference one way or another, and I doubt the doctor would even care. I've also had sutures WERE removed today changed to sutures ARE removed today.

Commas - me

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First let me say I have been a QA person for well over 20 years, recently bumped out when company sold because I made too much more than the new company's QA people. I took a straight typing job with a company and this incredibly young, very little experience typing put in a QA position sent me CRITICAL ERRORS when I sent a blank! I told the supervisor this is not how I treated my people and it is not correct. Blanks, commas, she rearranged words, you name it.

To "me" - R-E-S-P-E-C-T for you!

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I'm fortunate not to have the problem w/ blanks (unless it's a completely stupid move on my part and QA can get it in seconds). I have so much respect for you in being that fair. I really mean no disrespect for QA's as they have an important job to do, and he!!, yes, I love input when I don't get something. Difference is that I know when I don't know something. I just think much of it comes down to simple common sense. Either you get it or you don't, and if you don't, isn't it better to ask. You rock, ME.

From OP - Thanks! sm

[ In Reply To ..]
I'm definitely (or defiantly or definately, depending on which social network one uses) NOT perfect. I'm also very opened minded and will not argue when I did something stupid. I just don't feel that, in most cases, an extra comma can kill a patient.

That said, do any of you wk for a provider who has their own macros you pull in? If so, when you find something grammatically incorrect, spelling wrong, sentence structure wrong, etc., do you correct it? Wondering if now I could be marked off for correcting run-on sentences built into the macros.

re macro corrections - hmmm

[ In Reply To ..]
If I pull in a macro and found Tuohy needle spelled Tuouhy, *that* I correct. Otherwise, I leave it alone. You don't know who loaded that macro, QA or the doc (it should allllways go through QA, but go figure when it doesn't). In any event, we are but lowly MTs and changing run-on sentences in macros is not our primary concern (yes, I heard your fingernails on the blackboard when I said that).

Commas - NTS MT

[ In Reply To ..]
Didn't read all the posts, but if your are working for NTS, that is how they get you...commas. It is an easy way for them not to pay out bonuses. If you don't, you should have and if you do, you shouldn't have. I battle with my lead all the time about it.

I hear ya. - nuance2

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I am just doing my job the best I can. QA job is to NOT let you get bonuses. I've been a MT for 30 years. I'm working now while I job hunt for something different.

I don't change run-on sentences. - me

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Only misspelled words. I also do not check punctuation. Already getting paid crap for VR. Not about to waste more time checking macros.

Yes I do. - me

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I ALWAYS check the macros. A lot of them have erros and if you don't correct them, you will be marked off for that. You'd think the higher ups would go through them and correct each one but guess I'm dreaming. They're waaay to busy with their jobs to help us.

Re: Banging head... - sm

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You should absolutely document and report to higher-ups any QA who wastes everyone's time (plus the money her company is paying her for wages) on petty nit-picking and hair-splitting over trivialities that do not affect meaning. This is not the purpose of QA, and those who indulge in this are demonstrating that they are on a ''power trip'' and have no business being in QA in the first place.

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