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ICD-10 codes replacing ICD-9 codes - CTMT

Posted: Jul 14, 2012

Good morning all, I am a long-time MT considering medical coding as a new career as I love the medical language profession and do not want to leave, however, keeping a long-time MT job that makes money I can live on is becoming almost nonexist. By sheer luck, I met a manager of a small clinic that offered me a medical coding entry level job $16/hour with medical insurance paid for in full for a family. Only thing I have to do is pass the exam and become certified. She had to become certified herself and just studied the books and passed. She offered me the books and thinks I could study them with my medical language background and be able to pass too. I looked over the books and felt way over my head and decided I need to look into some kind of schooling first. My question is, should I bother now with ICD-10 codes coming to replace the ICD-9 codes. The office manager advised me to do it now while they are ICD-9 before ICD-10 come along. I was thinking maybe to wait and just learn when the ICD-10 are being taught. Any advice or thoughts would be appreciated.

Do not wait - Coder

[ In Reply To ..]
Do this now . . . do not wait. You need the job NOW, don't you? Or you already have it.

There is no reason to wait and many reasons you should not. ICD-10-CM, the dagnoses, is not that much different from 9. The inpatient procedures are different, but you do not need that in an office. When we study coding, we just learn to look up the codes. We do not memorize the codes themselves. Once you can use ICD-9, you will be able to transition to 10 in a few hours of training.

The procedure system used in outpatient settings is CPT, not ICD-10. Nothing will change.

The start date for 10 was October of 2013. It has been delayed again at least a year. You do not want to wait that long, I am sure.

Your office manager might have been able to study the books because she knew about coding or even how to code. You need to do thia quickly, so you can probably do ok with a local AAPC course. Those cover only outpatient. .

I am a MT in between jobs, again! - CTMT

[ In Reply To ..]
Just getting tired of it, realizing MT is being stamped out gradually and its time to get something else going. The office manager lady is someone I met her at a hairdressing school where i was getting my hair done (only $40 a school vs. a salon) (she said said she was burnt out as an office manager arguing with the physicians about things they have to do regarding all the new regulations, etc. thats why she was doing hairdressing school at night) Anyhow, she and I got to talking about our jobs and she said she is always looking for qualified coders, as they are hard to find. She offered me her exam books and I took them and have been thinking about the job ever since, but the exam would have to be passed first. She said the job is simply reviewing the codes the doctors have inserted themselves and we just make sure they are right and correct them if need be. It sounds like the exam will be the biggest obstacle for me as i learn jobs fairly quickly. I will look up local AAPC courses, thank you.

What exam do you need to pass? - Coder

[ In Reply To ..]
Jst to be sure, what exam? The CPC, I hope. A lot of coders can do fine with that on their own. Local chapters of AAPC sometimes teach the course in about 100 hours. There is also an online version at AAPC itself.

Which books did she give you? The ones from AAPC?

Go to the Medicare website (CMS) and find the Medicare Learning Network. There are online courses that you can do for free. There are also some very nice training manuals that will tell you all about what doctors need to do, how to code, etc.

You need a set of code books. The instructions for them are at the beginnings.

You might want to see if she will hire you now, into any any office role, so that you can see what the job is like. Or, see if she will let you observe in the office to see how to do this. Can she provide some OJT training?

Yes, there is a lot of interface with doctors over regulations. That is the bulk of some coder's jobs. I have never had to argue about it, though. If you interpret the requirements correctly and can explain and encourage, no arguing should be necessary. They want to get paid as much as you do.

That sounds like a job that is okay, but won't go very far - sm

[ In Reply To ..]
It sounds like a job you could stay in for a long time.

It isn't a job that a professional medical coder would be looking for necessarily. You'll be using a very limited amount of coding knowledge and skills. If you like it, that would be a good thing. It wouldn't necessarily have much growth. The important thing is to find out how much it pays. If you would be happy with that amount for a very long time, it might be a good opportunity. It won't be very good training for moving up in coding. It probably is very limited as far as raises. If you like it as it is, go for it! Good luck with your decision.

Why do you feel the need to... - Not a coder yet

[ In Reply To ..]
follow every post by Coder with your own negativity? Coder was trying to be encouraging and realistic, and yet you come along and state "it would not necessarily have much growth" and "it won't be very good training for moving up in coding." How can you possibly know these things? Any experience coding can be taken to a higher level depending on the person. It does not have to be a "very long time" dead-end, low paying job. OP look at it as a stepping stone to getting more education as a coder and higher pay.

I know - CTMT

[ In Reply To ..]
Everywhere I post on this site, i get that one negative comment by "sm" which I guess means "see message" Whatever, I say, most people are good here on MTstars, some are ignorant. I know $16 is low but I would be so greatful just to get my foot i the door, plus the office is only 20 minutes away, and near my childrens' school. At 8 cents a line MTing, $16 will be fine.

I believe this is my first reply to 'Coder' so I don't know what your message means - sm

[ In Reply To ..]
I gave my opinion. I don't remember replying to any other post by 'Coder', but if I believe I have something to say, I will say it.

Wondering if you are a coder - sm

[ In Reply To ..]
Surprising that you did not recognize the OP's job offer as a typical entry-level coding position and a darned good deal.

That is terrible advice! - Dismayed Coder

[ In Reply To ..]
There is absolutely nothing wrong with that job! It is exactly how many coders begin. They do not have to stay there! It just gets a foot in the door.

On this board we hear from a number of people who took a course and cannot get a job because they have no experience. Industry-wide, we see this in the numbers of college course graduates who cannot find jobs. Some are applying only to hospitals because that is what their school emphasized. Some do not consider office coding to be real coding. Some think it is beneath them. Some even refuse to consider it because they want to do a different kind of coding.

And then everyone begins to talk about how hard it is to break into coding.

It is difficult to break into any field. Look up the recent articles on how much trouble lawyers are having. They are thinking of reducing the number of seats in law school to compensate.

Coding is no different. Everyone would prefer an experienced coder. There just aren't enough to go around. If you play your cards right, you mght get an impressive first job. If not, then you might have luck taking any job you can get just to put the experience on your resume. You don't have to stay in that job forever.

For a smart MT, a doctors' office can be a good opportunity to see the difficulties that physicians struggle with and to learn enough about Medicare to turn that into a consulting job.

Many coders progress from entry jobs to others. They move sideways and upwards into different and more challenging jobs.

No school teaches everything. There is just too much. At best, they teach the bare minimum to get you started.

That job the OP mentioned is a great opportunity. It is fine way to get into the field, get experience, learn more, and earn a living while doing it. Once she iscomfortable in it, she can continue her education online, study for different credentials, get a degree or another degree, and move on to better jobs.

coding courses - transitioning MT

[ In Reply To ..]
AHIMA has coding certificate courses. I took the coding course through Santa Barbara City College. Both are online.

True, but she needs to get it done fast - Thinking of the situation

[ In Reply To ..]
Those courses would take too long and teach material she does not need right now. They teach outpatient mixed with inpatient, which she does not need for this job or exam, will require repeating prerequisite med terms and A&P, which she probably already has, and will include courses in medical record documentation that she could probably teach.

What she NEEDS for this job and exam is exactly what AAPC covers. That is the fastest route for her.

True - transitioning MT

[ In Reply To ..]
I meant take the job now, then sign up for online courses in whatever area of coding she plans to go into. I'm not trained in physician office coding, so I cannot advise on that route.

Thanks for all the great tips! - CTMT

[ In Reply To ..]
The office manager said everyone in the office was given a short amount of time to get certified as a coder, basically told to pass it if you want to stay, it became a requirement all of the sudden. I think she as an office manager had worked in hospitals and doctors office for 30+ and always did the coding without being certified, then it became an issue just recently. i think her clinic gets paid by Medicare and Medicaid a lot, because the clinic is in a city and I think she mentioned low-income patients, so anyway she cannot even hire me without passing the exam first. I think its just the CPC, that is all you need for an office, the CPC-H is for a hospital, right? She thinks because I have the medical language down, that I could pass the exam, but I need some training. i will look into those "free" online coding just to get a feel for it, thanks so much everyone :)

Studying for certification - medtranusa

[ In Reply To ..]
You can also pick up some used textbooks for low price, like Step By Step Medical Coding by Carol Buck. If you buy a copy for say 2011, you can get it much cheaper. Ask your new job if they have the code books so you don't have to buy those. Just start working your way through the book and the best resource will gbe your job and the experienced coders. I think you have a great opportunity. Good luck!

Also try Fordney's Insurance Handbook for the Medical Office - Coder

[ In Reply To ..]
It covers pretty much everything you need from an explanation of what types of people work in a medical office and what they do to completion of claim forms. It's a very good text, but you will need to supplement the ICD-9 and CPT code chapters with other books. You might want to begin with what is in this book, though, and supplement the coding after.

You really do need everything in the book if you are going to be doing coding in an office.

MT to coding - MJINATL

[ In Reply To ..]
I stumbled upon this site last week and glad I did!!! They also had a free webinar regarding their coding courses, specifically for people like you and I - MTs transitioning to coding. I've also spoken with the person, so I thought I'd just share this with you if you'd like to consider this. Prices are extremely reasonable and I WILL be taking courses beginning next month.

http://www.medlineschool.com/medical-coding-home/

Thank you - CTMT

[ In Reply To ..]
I got that website before the moderator deleted it! It looks great, but I could not find where you found the prices. Price is really important to me along with passing the exam at the end. I am out of work right now, so cannot afford $2000+ schools. Do you know how much the MT bridge to coding class is? Thank you

MT to coding - MJINATL

[ In Reply To ..]
I sent you an email, but check out the medlineschool.com website. Total cost for 6 months is $1800 and if you pay in full, you will get the books for free!!! ($375 savings). If you're like me and can't afford the total pay, he is willing to do $225/month for 7 months, but we must purchase our own books.

To CTMT - Coding student

[ In Reply To ..]
The first thing I want to say is that the job sounds like a great opportunity. I'm a new coder and have had trouble getting a job without experience, for me this would be perfect; I'd probably be happy to stay there too. I would suggest taking the job now if that's an option, the woman may not hold it for you while you take a course and become certified. If you do a program, I would also recommend the AAPC course as it's geared toward outpatient coding and it's a nationally recognized organization, but see if it's possible to do in conjunction with the job, maybe your employer will share some of the cost if she's having a hard time finding coders. I looked at the MedLine web site. They cite completing the program in 6 months, but I can say from experience that you will probably have to study like a maniac to do that. It also teaches inpatient coding, which you wouldn't need to work in a doctor's office. It may not be true for everyone, but as a student there were always concepts that I struggled with and I got bogged down in certain areas. It's not something that you can rush through, and being an MT does not necessarily guarantee success. I'm not trying to discourage you, but I want to be realistic. I think someone else suggested some books and study guides. One that I used is called "Principles of CPT Coding," published by the AMA. It will teach you everything you need to know about CPT and there are quizzes at the end of every section so you can review what you learned. The bottom line is that if you want to code, get your foot in the door. Take the job and go from there, good luck.

I know short coding class training will be a ton of homework - CTMT

[ In Reply To ..]
When I went to school for MT, I did a 5-month course and we met at the school 3 days a week and the other days including weekends I studied and did homework and transcribed. It was hard! So I imagine coding training will be the same. I found a local certified coding lady teaching classes meeting on Saturday starting in August and finishing in December with the exam at the end. I just hope I can afford it. She is sending me the paperwork. I cannot take the job now as everyone in the office has to be certified first because they get paid through Medicaid and Medicare. Its a new requirement the government has imposed I think last year. She sounded like she always needs certified coders as they are hard to find and she wanted someone like me with hands-on experience with real work in the medical field. She told me a lot of coders come to her fresh out of school having passed the exam, but I guess they are too much by the book and she is looking for a more open-minded flexible person.

Real work in medical field - On site MT

[ In Reply To ..]
That sounds great, but remember that coding and MT are not the same. Knowing medical terms and anatomy will help you in your studies, but unless you've had "hands on" coding experience your other work won't apply. Is "the exam at the end" the CPC exam? That is the one you need to take to become certified as an outpatient coder. There's a $300 testing fee, make sure that is what your class is preparing you for. You'll also need to join AAPC. After you are credentialed there are continuing ed requirements in order to keep your certification, I don't know if anyone told you that. Coding is "by the book" so that's kind of a strange statement. I'm surprised that they're willing to hold a job for you for that length of time, she must really want you, good luck.

Agree, that is a worrisome statement - Worried

[ In Reply To ..]
Every coder I know would be concerned by the "codig is by the book" statement.

To be blunt about it, I would never consider working for anyone who said that to me because it sounds as though she wants you to engage in fraudulent or abusive practices. Coding IS by the book and federal law, and we do not deviate from that. It would be wrong, for one, and nobody wants to go to prison.

If this lady has trouble keeping coders, that is why. They quit for ethical reasons.

Her unhappiness with having to argue with doctors is another clue pointing toward this.

More likely to have little homework. - Hard to say

[ In Reply To ..]
It is very unlikely that the program just crams 12 to 18 months into 6, requiring students to do double or triple homework. It is more likely that the course is just stripped down, or offers less detail, or contains less exercise material, or that they know it will take longer than they say, but plan to offer extensions or to require you to sign up for the course again.

Not trying to be snarky with this. It is just a truism that shorter courses teach less or teach less detail.

You said what I was thinking! - nm

[ In Reply To ..]
nm

AHDI would find it funny that they claim to be "approved" by them - sm

[ In Reply To ..]
AHDI doesn't approve coding courses. We used to see this kind of false advertising in MT programs. I sure hope it isn't starting for the coding courses. That's just tacky.

I remember! - Seasoned MT/Coder

[ In Reply To ..]
I sure do remember back when there was a new MT school every week or two. They would make ridiculous claims, hire grads to come on boards and promote them, and then fade away. Usually they did the same thing. They would claim to be approved by AHDI when they weren't. They always had some excuse like, it was a different AHDI (AAMT) and AAMT didn't own those initials. Sleaziness happens. Not much anyone can do about it.

they are ahdi approved for transcription - MJINATL

[ In Reply To ..]
to sm - they ARE AHDI approved for transcription - they have common sense to know that AHDI does not approve coding courses..... Just sayin'

It clearly says on the Coding page that they are an AHDI approved course - Look Again

[ In Reply To ..]
nm

AHDI and website - On site MT

[ In Reply To ..]
They teach MT, that is what they did originally, then started offering coding programs. They are AHDI approved for their MT program. AHDI has nothing to do with coding. AHIMA and AAPC are the organizations representing coders.

Potential students do not know that - All that matters

[ In Reply To ..]
Makes no difference if they have common sense or not, or that THEY know what AHDI is, or what it "really" means. Placing the AHDI logo on the coding webpage makes it appear that the coding program is approved when it is not.

Prospective customers should not have to hire industry experts to interpret coding program advertising.

Potential students - On site MT

[ In Reply To ..]
Prospective customers/students need to learn how to research those things, it doesn't take an "industry expert" to get that information.

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