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one space after punctuation - kabina

Posted: Jan 24, 2013

Why would a transcription company you are working for ask you to only put one space after puncutation, like a period? To cut down on your lines?

Because this is the correct way... and also sm - me

[ In Reply To ..]
It has nothing to do with cutting down your line count. One space after a period is correct. This changed a few decades ago, when computers came into place and has to do with the typesetting as well as English evolving (remember way back when today was to-day?). Also, if you have justified text, more than 1 space will leave a gapping hole.

All of the transcriptionists I know who still use 2 spaces will also type anywhere from 2-4 spaces after a period. There are also the unscrupulous ones who do it for line padding.

I for one have better things to do in my life than remove extra spaces prior to sending reports to the client.

who are you to say - this is the correct way?

[ In Reply To ..]
I began in 1969, saw the whole evolution, and no one has ever told me that "one space after a period is correct." I have always used two spaces, and in the six different places I have worked from 1969 to the present, no one has ever told me to use one space. And no, it's not padding lines. And no, I am not unscrupulous. It just makes the document more readable.

That's not what I was taught in high school and college. - only 15 years ago

[ In Reply To ..]
Thats certainly not "decades" ago, and also I've never heard of putting 1 space after a period anywhere outside of MT. I absolutely believe it's a money saver. One of my supervisors (in MT) told me the reason was to prevent "rivers" that are distracting in the paragraphs. Even so, I certainly wouldn't say that 1 space is correct. When I hear an English professor tell me that, I'll believe it.

Then read this ... - anon

[ In Reply To ..]
http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/spaces-period-end-of-sentence.aspx

I quote:
"Although how many spaces you use is ultimately a style choice, using one space is by far the most widely accepted and logical style. The Chicago Manual of Style (1), the AP Stylebook (2), and the Modern Language Association (3) all recommend using one space after a period at the end of a sentence"

1) I don't trust anything that comes out of Chicago. - 2)...

[ In Reply To ..]
It may be the most widely accepted, but all of my schooling taught me that 2 spaces was correct, so that doesn't mean it was the ONE AND ONLY CORRECT WAY as the poster so rudely insisted. Your very own quote says that. "Although how may spaces you use is ultimately a style choice." That does NOT imply that one space is the one and only correct way. I have never heard of using one space outside of MT, and I didn't go to school to be an MT. I fell into it with a much higher education level than MT required, so I'd say that my sampling of the world is just as accurate as that of people who HAVE run into people using 1 space. Again, that does not make it THE CORRECT WAY, just the supposedly more common way (depending on who you talk to and what sources you are looking at). Apparently most teachers in the state of Michigan don't agree since I and all of my old high school friends, who went to a large variety of colleges, all still use the 2 spaces as we were taught.

Years ago - Old MT

[ In Reply To ..]
when typeface was not scalable, it was considered correct to place two spaces after a period at the end of a sentence. Now fonts used are scalable and since most records are computerized and don't ever make to paper, the tradition of two spaces is usally not followed. I still do it, out of habit, but since I am not paid for spaces but only for VBC, it doesn't matter to my employer or their clients. The only QA stipulation for this is that we are consistent throughtout the report. Most companies, esp those who pay for spaces, are requesting only one space after the period at the end of a sentence.

one space - kabina

[ In Reply To ..]
still sounds to me like they are just trying to save themselves some money and lines. I mean why else would they do that?

one space - 1 space forward, 2 spaces backward

[ In Reply To ..]

My advice would be to do as the client asks of course. However, there is no Punctuation God who 20-30 years ago decreed that we must all only put one space after a period. Believe me I was around then and I would have remembered as I remember my electric typewriter with the manual throw and the wonderful wonderful day I got a self-correcting Selectric, I remember the Magcard, I remember the Wang, I remember the Lanier wordprocessing station, I remember my $8500 8088 PC with 2 floppy drives and no hard drive. I remember wordstar, wordperfect 4.0, and the wonderful wonderful wordperfect 5.1 which was the best ever word processing program ever written. But I do not remember the Punctuation God sending down Transcribing Moses with two rigid microdisks containing the new commandment, "Thou shalt not insert 2 spaces after a period."

Certainly, it makes no difference to the computer printer, whatsoever how many spaces you put after a period. It might make a difference to the software perhaps, if your software automatically inserted a 2nd space after a period or some such thing.

What was a problem though, with the typewriter-type printers, were subscripts and superscripts and we did have to take this into consideration, and I do remember the RRA, the head of medical records, decreeing that the doctors were just going to have to put up with it. But then with the advent of high quality print producing dot matrix printers this was no longer a problem.

And trust me on this, as a small business transcription owner I have done quite a bit of programming over the years and I am pretty knowledgable, it makes no diffence how many spaces you put in after a period if you are justifying your document. In any case, it isn't a printer thing at all. It is the software that does this, and it basically ignores extra spaces in the document; it just spreads and condenses text as needed (which is why when you leave a blank, and are not using a proprietary platform that may have its own way of handling blanks, you should insert a line or your blank will be lost if the document is justified.)

I am an old school MT, I have been doing this for a good 40 years now, and I started on a typewriter. It is a matter of habit with me to type 2 spaces after a period. In fact, my old school supervisor in those days, not to mention those old school doctors, would not have liked it one little bit if I only put in one period after a sentence, and it would certainly have invited plenty of retype if I did so routinely (occasionally I did leave a letter out of a word and would try to squeeze the letter in, rather than start over but if I didn't do it neatly, the retype was inevitable.)

I rather suspect the doctors and nurses don't like this practice now, it certainly makes the documents less readable) and I absolutely do think it is about saving money and has absolutely NOTHING to do with printers, and if anybody is telling you otherwise they are mistaken.

In those days, I most certainly did not insert 2 periods to pad my lines and I don't do so for that reason now, its motor memory plus I believe it makes the document harder to read so unless I am specifically requested otherwise, I insert 2 periods at the end of a sentence and after a colon; it is my default mode. If the client wishes, I can run a search and replace to get rid of the extra space, but under no circumstances I going to try to lose this habit of a lifetime, which I believe creates a more readable document.

And by the way, in those days, I was just as productive as I am now. I routinely turned out 1500 to 2000 lines a day with no expansion programs, and making 4-6 carbon copies which all had to be perfect, and on top of that each copy was different color, which meant eraser for the original, and a different bottle of correction fluid for each copy!

But now I find after all these years, I am a dishonest line padder! And what is with the insults on this forum lately? This morning I find that I am carrying the stigma of being an MT, and it may take many years to rise above this shame. Yesterday I find that I am not worth $25 an hour (maybe the person who posted that isn't but I certainly am!)

I agree - Old MT

[ In Reply To ..]
I still do the two spaces mostly out of muscle memory, too, and I agree that it makes the document more readable. We had a big problem when my original MR Dept changed over to laser printers with a scalable font that made all kinds of problems with margin alignment. We never did fully justified documents, though, and IMO fully justified documents without a scalable font are really hard to read.

Since my employer doesn't pay for spacing (which I think is wrong but can't do anything about except change jobs, which I am not willing to do at this time), then I still do two spaces after a period at the end of a sentence and after a colon.

i totally agree! - dm

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I agree. Two-spacer here. - nm

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x

I still do two spaces - Old School

[ In Reply To ..]
I know they said it changed, but I haven't had a job that required only one space. I don't do it for the lines, my brain is just trained that way. Hopefully, I don't have to re-train my brain any time soon.

to one space forward, love your post - OHMT

[ In Reply To ..]
I also remember the days of Selectric typewriters (remember the font ball that jumped around in there as you typed? - I can still hear that annoying sound!). I remember the first "electronic" typewriter I had. It had a little screen so you could see what you were typing, and it wouldn't print until you reached the end of the line. That was great for fixing typos before they hit the paper. The young-uns have no idea how easy they have it now!

I also leave two spaces after a period, always have. On one of my accounts, the program is actually better if you do it that way. When you leave two spaces, the first word of the next sentence automatically capitalizes, but does not if you leave one space. On another account, we are allowed to do it either way as long as we are consistent.

I used to type for a journalist and one day she asked me to start typing one space instead of two. It had to do with her formatting of the document, and up until that point she was going through the whole report removing my extra spaces! I gladly accommodated her but it definitely took some getting used to.

I do agree that I think a document is easier to read with two spaces. You said you type two spaces but in your post it appears as if there is only one space between sentences, so apparently the program is adjusting it whether we like it or not.

Thanks for the trip down memory lane, and have a great, productive day!

yep. two spaces here, not reprogramming my hands. - old as gold but shines. NM

[ In Reply To ..]
]

Does this - even matter?

[ In Reply To ..]
Couldn't they just set their program to put one space after a period anyway if that's what they wanted?

lots of reasons - ICManiac

[ In Reply To ..]
The real push on single spacing came after the MQ lawsuit claiming they fraudently overbilled clients out of millions of dollars. MQ had to admit they had no uniformity in their billing practices and could not account for why they billed clients the way they did. That lawsuit was the spring board for a lot of changes with single spacing and VBC leading the pack.

More than one MTSO has instituted programming on their platforms that will convert all spacing after a period to a single space.

Back in the day (think DOS operating systems), you would be shocked to know how many MTs would pad their line counts by writing macros to insert spaces to make paragraphs appear as though they were made by hitting enter (or return on old typewriters) twice. They would get paid for each of those spaces rather than one or two keystrokes to separate the paragraphs.

Single spacing has become the trend to protect the client and MTSOs from fraudulent billing.

single spacing - kabina

[ In Reply To ..]
I figured it was just to save them money on paying our lines, maybe not though.

You do have the right to be - paranoid

[ In Reply To ..]
that they will try to rob us at every turn if they can get away with it!

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