A community of 30,000 US Transcriptionist serving Medical Transcription Industry

Does anyone belong to a union? - Not AHDI, a proper union

Posted: Sep 03, 2014

I am just wondering if anyone out there belongs to a union like SEIU? I know they mainly represent nurses and home health aides, etc., but I wonder if you joined it would that be of any benefit, would they be able to help with our working conditions, would you be able to elect their benefits rather than the MTSO ones?

I am not interested in AHDI because basically it seems to provide absolutely NO job security or protection, no benefits to joining, and in fact your reward for obtaining their certifications seems to be just a few letters after your name and doling out more dollars every year for dues and recertification, which really does NOT seem to increase your salary in any way OR enable you to be preferred for any job any longer.

The only criteria for employers now seems to be how low can they pay you, so it seems counterindicated to keep up the certification anymore. Also, from what I have read on this board, THEY are the ones who started with the offshoring. So thanks AHDI. Great job for us MTs you did.

I am sitting here with no work and faced again with the prospect of using up all my PTO again because the MTSO I work for is apparently not required to pay me for hours sitting here waiting for work, and just wondering if there is any way joining a proper union could help with this situation, or any of the other intolerable working conditions we are suffering right now.

Anybody out there with a story to tell about their union membership? I would appreciate hearing, good or bad. Please no "UNIONS ARE EVIL" talking points, unless you have a personal story to tell one way or another, thanks.

SEIU and other unions - My 2 cents

[ In Reply To ..]
I was a member of AAMT (now AHDI) back in the early days. I remember back then that they made clear that their purpose was never to become involved in wage or workplace issues. In regard to SEIU - I do not belong to a union but our nurses have contract. I know transcriptionists at other facilities who were union members. When their employers chose to convert to VR or Epic, the union had no control over that and their transcription jobs were eliminated. The union did help them find other jobs on site. As far as being a union member and working for an MTSO, I am not sure how that would work as generally the employer has to be a "union shop," I don't see any MTSO doing that. I don't know if you could join a union as an individual and have any bargaining power. As far as organizing at-home MTs, that would be a huge undertaking and I'm not sure how they would contact people. No union can guarantee work for you if the work is not there. It would be awfully hard to enforce labor laws when people are working out of their homes and so many people are IC. Also, when domestic MTs start demanding higher pay, the work will go offshore because the Indians don't care about unions. If there were not other people available to do the work, you would have more clout. This question has come up many times before, but unless someone actually contacts a union organizer you will not know whether or not you can make it work. I'm on the fence about labor unions. I don't think they are evil, but I would not particularly want my dues going to support their political agenda. I've been lucky to have never had to work for an MTSO and I've always had decent employers without the need to organize, but I understand your situation.

Thanks for your input - about your experiences

[ In Reply To ..]
I guess joining as an individual (which was my thought) would not accomplish anything.

It seems ridiculous that you would actually have to request the MTSO to become a union shop, though, surely no employer would voluntarily do that, they would have to be forced. Here's where, as you mention, the allowing and, in fact, encouraging of offshoring is a real handicap to anyone trying to get decent working conditions in our job.

These MTSOs must be overjoyed they have such an easy target in us home MTs, as it is obviously even more difficult to organize when everyone's spread across the country with different state labor laws to confound the process.

As far as the benefits available to union members, though, specifically as regards health insurance, for instance (my MTSO offers a terrible grandfathered plan which in my case is worse than nothing), I wonder if it would be worth joining just to get decent health insurance benefits? Hard to imagine paying dues plus premiums would be at all affordable, but honestly I will not give my premium to my MTSO when absolutely everything is paid out of pocket for thousands of dollars before the deductible is reached.

I see many advantages - sm

[ In Reply To ..]
I think unions can make a comeback. For a start, a union could plan a "big vision" plan. For a start, when a hospital/provider plans to outsource, the provider could be persuaded to put into the contract that "work must not be off-shored" and must have a least one person review the work with quality assurance oversight. An MT union could lobby for a national minimum wage so that there would not be discrimination between states. A union could lobby for and address the issues of OOW/on call. I think the restaurant workers have unionized without a "shop."

How much would you be willing to pay for dues for an organization that could provide public relations, etc? A penny a report? $25.00 a year?

I think a retired MT with come extra energy could pick up the baton, probably at first a volunteer, but eventually they should have some compensation, expense account, perhaps a Board, etc.

I have been "saved" by a union when a boss took a dislike to me (I pointed out her very bad mistake to her boss and my boss tried to retaliate). The union leaders to have to play ball with the bosses and sometimes unpopular compromises have to be made. A compromise is better than nothing, though.

Public relations? - sm

[ In Reply To ..]
A website--for education (teaching people about their health records) and for MTs as a document bank for news releases, letters, etc., to inform people about losing jobs to off-shoring.
Displays at conventions, labor events, highlighting quality health records and jobs. Sometimes websites become self-sustaining for ads, right?

Too many "I can't do anything attitudes."

Oh I'd pay more than that - if they could achieve anything

[ In Reply To ..]
Like what you are talking about, honestly. I would gladly pay $50-100/month if we could get ANY representation at all that would mean the MTSOs could be held accountable for the OOW/not paying situation, for example.

After all, that $50-100 is about 1 day's pay, and if they are made to pay us it is surely worth paying it out in dues or what have you to force them to treat us as proper employees.

You seem to know a bit about it. The restaurant workers seem to be in even more dire straits than us (some of them), so when you say they unionized without a "shop" could we effect the same?

Even a crowd funding site, if it had a specific goal or some kind of plan of visibility, might be viable. Honestly, I personally am ready to do something. I'll take the premiums for the pretty much worthless MTSO health insurance and pay them to something like this instead.

I personally am not too knowledgeable about unions, yet if I know anything about being an MT, we are DEFINITELY good researchers. Thanks for giving me some food for thought. Please continue if you can think of more.

Advantages - My 2 cents

[ In Reply To ..]
The no-outsource clause in a contract would be great, but you'd have to find a facility that isn't already outsourcing, I don't think there are that many left - do you see them bringing the work back on site?
Secondly the union would need to have a presence in the facility, it could not just be an MT union. A union cannot do anything about OOW, either there is work or there isn't, they can't pull it out of their hat so that you will have something to do. Fast food workers may have organized without a "shop," but those employers can hire and fire whoever they choose, a lot of them may find themselves without jobs. I think paying someone $15 an hour to ask "do you want fries with that?" is a joke; that skews the entire pay system, some of them will be making more than people involved in direct patient care, bus drivers and a lot of other people in much more responsible jobs. Heck, I'd like to be making $30 an hour, but it's not going to happen. Speaking for myself, when I retire the last thing I want to do is become involved in union organizing. Why do you think that a retired MT would have extra energy or even care once they are gone? Your situation with the union sounds very unpleasant, I would imagine that created some disharmony among your team members. It may be possible to become a union member without a "shop." I'm only saying this because I have worked for 2 facilities where union organizers were on the premises trying to get people to join, it was my understanding that the hospital had to agree to let the union in and become a "union shop," which they didn't, and that kind of thing can get ugly. With MT, employers have options now in regard to getting their work done. In today's economy I don't see any facility willing to hire 10 MTs at $20 an hour plus perks and benefits when they can go overseas and hire people to do the work for a third of the cost. My facility's transcription work is offshored and we still do on site QA, you don't need a union to make that happen. This might have been a good idea 10 years ago but I'm afraid it might be too late.

Accentuate the negative - and do not move on

[ In Reply To ..]
First of all, I said to put in the contract to not "off-shore" not out-source.

I am not here to debate how much a fast food worker is worth.

My union stood behind me when the immediate boss got ugly. Everyone in the union was very supportive. Actually most of the people in management were, too. They knew the consequences of her mistake.

There are many retired people who enjoy being involved in communities, churches and voluteerism to make the world a better place for others.

As far as employees having to be in a shop, there are home health care workers that are organized, actors that are organized and all kinds of trade councils. Also posted here were organization such as AARP. Ever hear of the American Medical Association?

Check out SEIU:

About SEIU
The Service Employees International Union (SEIU) unites 2 million diverse members in the United States, Canada and Puerto Rico. Focused on uniting workers in three sectors to improve their lives and the services they provide, SEIU is:

The largest healthcare union, with more than 1.1 million members in the field, including nurses, LPNs, doctors, lab technicians, nursing home workers, and home care workers.
The largest property services union, with 225,000 members in the building cleaning and security industries, including janitors, security officers, superintendents, maintenance workers, window cleaners, and doormen and women
The second largest public services union, with more than 1 million local and state government workers, public school employees, bus drivers, and child care providers
Vision for a Just Society
We believe in and will fight for a just society:
Where all workers are valued and all people are respected.
Where all families and communities thrive.
Where we leave a better and more equal world for generations to come.

Can't answer your questions, not a union member - and would never be. NM

[ In Reply To ..]
]

You are confusing unions and - professional organizations

[ In Reply To ..]
ADHI is a professional organization. It is not a union, nor should there be any expectation that it should be.

Unions do not provide credentials. They cannot force employers to keep you in a job. They can't stop employers from offshoring.

I belong to a union and it does not provide "benefits" in competion with the employer. I pay about $30 amonth for membership, too.

Okay, my bad - Is your union a health care one?

[ In Reply To ..]
Personally, I have absolutely no use for the AHDI, whatever it is. A professional organization who have sped the demise of the profession? I ask you, why would you join that and give them money?

I don't actually want the union to keep me in a job OR stop the employers from offshoring, basically my interest in a union (or really anything at this point - DOL, some other national agency, whatever) would be that since we are called employees we actually get treated like employees and if we show up to work our shift and there is no work, it is on the employer, just like it would be in the real world in a real job, if you see what I mean. They don't get to send you home and say no work today so no pay, nor should MTSOs.

You can actually get group health insurance through some unions, but perhaps that would be those either in professions with union shops built in to the workplace, or perhaps just another option for those who aren't offered it by their employers.

I think $30 a month does not sound bad. Do you mind divulging what union it is and/or why you joined and/or what you gain from being a part of it?

Thanks for anything you can offer.

Employers do not have to pay you - if there is no work

[ In Reply To ..]
They can just send you home.

I do not agree - I have had many jobs

[ In Reply To ..]
If they run out of work, they find something for you to do, they even let you sit around, but they do NOT send you home and not pay you.

Why? Because when you get a job the understanding is, as an employee and not a contractor, you will get paid for 40 hours a week and you will work 40 hours a week.

If your job no longer has work, then you get laid off or you get switched to a different job within the company, but, no, not in a REAL job, any job I have had they do NOT send you home and say you get no pay because we have no work.

I do not think that is legal, and it shouldn't be legal for our job either.

Getting sent home - My 2 cents

[ In Reply To ..]
At my onsite transcription job when we were NJA which was rare, the server went down or there were technical issues, they didn't find things for 15-20+ people to do. No one got paid to sit around. If it was going to be a long time, people got sent home. We were expected to make up our time or use PTO. In the real world, people don't get paid to do nothing. I'm not sure what a union is supposed to do about getting work for you to do. Whether or not you get paid is at the discretion of the employer unless it is written into the union contract. The employer is not required by law to pay you when there is nothing for you to do. If you're sitting there doing nothing you have not worked.

Statement about companies just sending you home. sm - Union Family

[ In Reply To ..]
With all due respect, that is actually not correct. If the union has negotiated a contract, that language is put in there about being paid 4 hours, for example, for being "called into work".

I always (I guess mistakenly) thought that - employees did have some rights

[ In Reply To ..]
In this country. I lived in another country for awhile and they seemed to think you needed unions for good working conditions and benefits, and my working life here I always did not seem to need that, remembered the posters up in every workplace telling you your rights as an employee.

But it seems those rights never existed or have been eroded.

I do NOT think you should need a union to protect the right to have a proper job whereby if they say you are a full time employee and cannot find work for you to do, it is up to them to either find something for you to do or lay you off. If they say you have to go home and make up the time, as long as that is the exception and not the rule, that's probably okay.

However, this has become the rule with us MTs at home, whereby you go to work in the morning, there's no work, it's up to YOU to find the 8 hours, not them.

My problem with this is what is a job then? Nothing more than a contract that says you are promised this work and this is what you get if you do that work, etc. This is how you base your life. Can I afford this house, this car, etc., food to eat.

If employers are now allowed to say go home, we got no work, but turn up tomorrow and keep scratching to make that 40 hours or else, then we are really not much more than slaves, no? How do you build a life on that?

Yes, I do think having a job should mean if they don't have the work it's on them to find it or lay you off, not try to hire new people and leave even more people flapping in the wind, but employers are now able to reduce benefits, working conditions and pay to virtually whatever they want. How on earth did this happen?

If you think that's a good thing, I do not. Even the lowliest employee needs to feel secure in their job, and messing around with hours, working conditions, cutting pay to the bone is not good for security. I don't care if this profession is going down the tubes, while we are doing this job it should be a job.

Try do a search on wage theft - sm

[ In Reply To ..]
Many interesting sites listing organizations to help.

This late in the game - it would be a nearly

[ In Reply To ..]
impossible undertaking to unionize. What I know of organizing a union (which is not a great deal) is that it would have to be your particular MTSO. The MTSO does not sponsor or agree to the union, but they cannot interfere with the employees' right to organize. The workers employed by the MTSO would have to unionize, and how would that be accomplished since they work very hard to make sure that MTs do not know who their "coworker MTs" are?

Labor unions very often have contracts with craft corporations to only hire union employees. A good example would be the UAW and american car manufacturers or Teamsters and truck drivers, etc. When employees successfully unionize, it is usually because they together are able to exercise leverage as a collective group who actually can put a corporation out of business or hamper its operation enough to threaten the survival of the business.

The MTSOs are not in a position where we as a group could exercise that kind of leverage that would threaten the survival of their business. It would probably just accelerate the rate at which MT work is offshored and they would at the same time say that they did it for the survival of their business and say that they were justified in doing so.

As far as being required to sit on the system and wait for work, and then have to make up the lines at other times, have you contacted your Federal and State Wage and Hour? If you can track the hours that you put in sitting and waiting for work and that you are not paid unless lines are produced during that time, that you have to work more hours than you receive compensation for, that would seem to be a violation of wage and hour standards. That sometimes is all that is needed for the agencies to look into that MTSO's practices with all of their employees. Do you put in the actual time on the system and then use your PTO to get paid for time already put in on the system because there was no work for production? I would document as much as I could, and then contact your Wage and Hour offices and let them do the job they are being paid to do by looking into your complaint.

This is not meant to add to your discouragement, it is just that it would be misleading to encourage it when there is not really even a slim hope of succeeding, and I could not in good conscience encourage such a waste of time and energy.

I truly hope that something that I have said here is able to help you, if even only in some small way.

When I was in a new union before - sm

[ In Reply To ..]
when the new union was forming, everything possible was said and done to discourage the union from forming. There are many solutions to a problem. Last summer, there was an organized walkout at McDonald's restaurants and it was successful (it is a franchise, so I don't know if ALL were successful, but some were).

The negativity abounds with why we cannot do something. There are many working MTS in the US who would benefit. Perhaps a NEW professional organization that would work for MTs. (I am thinking along the lines of AARP or the NRA now). The politicians are extremely afraid of Association of Retired Persons and the National Rifle Association. Think outside of the box and be positive. Also check out the wage theft organizations.

My husband has been a union member for over 40 years. sm - Union Family

[ In Reply To ..]
His union is affiliated with SEUI.
He is retired now and is still a member. I'm in the process of joining myself as a spouse of a retiree. My father belonged to unions as a factory worker and a construction worker when I was growing up. If it was not for the unions, we would not have had food on our table, medical benefits, nor would my dad have had a pension when he retired. Companies have always wanted to pay the least they can get away with. I don't get all the bad mouthing of unions. I don't know what a union could do for MTs at this point since we are all over the country, but it is an interesting concept. Obviously, AHDI or whatever it is these days was never a union. I quit them a long time ago when they started embracing offshoring our work. My husband's dues were never high. $26 biweekly, now $3 a month as a retiree. I guess it depends on the contract.

My brother's shop tried to get a union, but the business owner went around telling individual employees that they would be better off without the union, so not enough employees voted to have a union. Too bad. Well, they were not better off.

your unionized family worked under one roof. Just how are unions - going to take care of MTs in the

[ In Reply To ..]
MT world of ALL workers for any given MTSO sitting in different states with all MTSOs sitting in different states, and both working on accounts for companies in different states?

The whole working world is not that of your unionized prior generations' experience when unions made a dent before they just took the dues and payoffs. Bad enough my money goes to taxes. Unions today, same thing in my opinion. Bunch of idiots on my dime and time, for nothing.

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